Virginia Tech Shooter Was Cho Seung-Hui, a U.S. Permanenent Resident From Korea
Police identified the classroom shooter as Cho Seung-Hui, 23, a senior from South Korea who was in the English department and lived in another dorm on campus. They said Cho committed suicide after the attacks, and there was no indication Tuesday of a possible motive. [AP]
Police also report, however, that Cho left behind a “disturbing” note that may give us some idea what kind of ideas took root inside this young man’s fevered mind. I’ll post more when I know more.
And yes, he was described as “a loner.”
Update: Photo cred: ABC News.
Update 2: Some irony from the Korean Embassy:
South Korea’s Foreign Ministry also expressed its condolences, saying there was no known motive for the shootings and that South Korea hoped that the tragedy would not “stir up racial prejudice or confrontation.”
Yes, let’s all learn from Korea’s example. We should never, ever hate or generalize about an entire group based on the crimes — much less the mere accidents — of a few individuals. That would be irrational. I think the Embassy’s statement is at once insulting and telling.
Update 3: Is this perverse vindication for Lee Won Bok? Thank God for a “wall of Jews” that stood bravely in the way of evil. [More.]
Update 4: Much more about the killer’s motives: First, and contrary to the speculation of some commenters below, he was an equal opportunity murderer (thanks to a reader). We also learn that nationalism has once again lured the Chosun Ilbo into a spurious and incorrect line of speculation:
Commenting on reports that the killer was Asian, Lee said it was unlikely to have been Korean since few Korean students have weapons due to the difficulty of obtaining a gun license.
I’m so embarrassed for them, and for Yonhap, which is tersely describing the killer, a Korean citizen, as an “ethnic Korean.” On the other hand, you have to wonder what this poor guy did:
We also learn some unsurprising things about the killer’s mental health:
The gunman suspected of carrying out the Virginia Tech massacre that left 33 people dead was identified Tuesday as a English major whose creative writing was so disturbing that he was referred to the school’s counseling service.
News reports also said that he may have been taking medication for depression, that he was becoming increasingly violent and erratic, and that he left a note in his dorm in which he railed against “rich kids,” “debauchery” and “deceitful charlatans” on campus.
Cho Seung-Hui, a 23-year-old senior, arrived in the United States as boy from South Korea in 1992 and was raised in suburban Washington, D.C., officials said. He was living on campus in a different dorm from the one where Monday’s bloodbath began.
[…] Lucinda Roy, the department’s director of creative writing, […] had Cho in one of her classes and described him as “troubled.”
“There was some concern about him,” Rude said. “Sometimes, in creative writing, people reveal things and you never know if it’s creative or if they’re describing things, if they’re imagining things or just how real it might be. But we’re all alert to not ignore things like this.”
She said Cho was referred to the counseling service, but she said she did not know when, or what the outcome was. Rude refused to release any of his writings or his grades, citing privacy laws.
The Chicago Tribune reported on its Web site that he left a note in his dorm room that included a rambling list of grievances. Citing identified sources, the Tribune said he had recently shown troubling signs, including setting a fire in a dorm room and stalking some women.
Investigators believe Cho at some point had been taking medication for depression, the newspaper reported.
Update 5: OK, I’ve just perused a “play” Cho wrote, now posted at The Smoking Gun, and to me, this truly looks like a case of a deranged individual with some very serious mental health problems. In spite of some unsourced murmurs I see on the net, nothing about Cho or his problems appears to be specifically or uniquely Korean. This guy was just crazy.
Plenty of people have concluded that the answer to this problem is to control guns. I differ from those people (see comments). I wish, for example, that Liviu Librescu had had a gun. I think the answer is to do a better job of controlling (a) criminals, and (b) the unmedicated insane. And whatever medications Cho was on were not enough.
Update 6: For those who want to know more, see Richardson’s post. The killer may have had a Cyworld page, too, but it’s not confirmed, and it’s just more insane ranting.
Update 7: The Korean-American Coalition has published a statement of condolence, which is both well-intentioned, and in my view, unnecessary. Maybe it’s this idea of group identity that I’ve never felt comfortable with, but this guy was just a crazy individual. Other Koreans or Korean-Americans are not responsbile for his actions any more than most American soldiers are responsible for a small number of thugs wailing on Korean taxi drivers at Camp Casey. This was not a crime of nationalism. There is not a need for the kind of introspection the Muslim world failed to have after 9/11. This was one insane, evil, individual SOB.
Update 8, 19 April 2007: OK, I see a whole new kind of madness taking shape: Korean and, yes, American media are spreading junk “news” — which turns out to be based on a few anonymous idiotic blog comments and some active imaginations — that South Koreans and Korean-Americans are hiding in their basements and keeping their kids home from school over the fear of reprisal attacks. See also GI Korea’s extensive post.
Now, I don’t know about you, but this weekend, I’m going to be in a crowded shopping mall somewhere with the three people in this world I love the most — all of them at least 50% Korean by ethnicity — without a hint of fear for their safety. I call bullshit — evil, fetid, manipulative, cynical, fear-mongering bullshit — and I challenge anyone to find a substantial factual basis for it.
Since I’m not seeing one, how can I explain the inexplicable? I mean, what kind of a society would break out into mass mobbery in reaction to one isolated tragic event? Who would turn hatred of a friendly allied nation into fodder for popular movies and songs? Who would use another nation’s most painful living memory as an occasion to show its hatred? Who would discriminate against an entire national group, commit multiple acts of random violence (here, here, here, here, here), or peddle hate to the kiddies in school (here, here, here, with extra points for the approving reference to 9-11)? What nation would seek political advantage from one tragic event by propogating hatred for an entire nation (here, here, and here), much less find it to be a winning electoral strategy? And where would such hatred find broad societal acceptance? Surely not in an educated, developed, industrialized society. No civilized people in our times could subscribe to the inspiration of the world’s most brutal and backward system of government, one that openly espouses racism and is willing to kill as many babies as necessary to prove its commitment to that notion of purity.
Now, let me just briefly speak to that two percent of you who are not mature adults for a moment. My point here is not to justify in any way this kind of bigotry toward persons of Korean ancestry or any other. (Fair warning: anyone leaving a comment to that effect can expect to see it removed, and to be banned for good.) Nor is my point to deny that bigotry exists here, although I submit that our society overwhelmingly rejects it, and will severely punish anyone a court of law convicts of acting on it.
Now, directing my voice to back the adults … my point here is to suggest that the great majority of the bigotry and generalizing — both of Americans and of Koreans — is happening in South Korea, where I sense a lot of mental role reversal happening. I also suspect that for many of the same people, the acceptance of collective guilt is just a stepping stone to a claim of collective victimhood, which leads right back to collective scapegoating. Does anyone else see a pattern here?
This is wrong on several levels, starting with the fact that the 32 actual victims haven’t even buried yet. We should be mourning them. We live in a world where there’s plenty of real victimhood and little need to invent more. I’d like to see a whole lot less of all of this “collective” b.s. on all sides of all oceans, regardless of the nationalities of those concerned. I mean, didn’t Brian express it best? So please, let’s call off the Category 5 pogrom alert.
What is Cho’s family’s religion?
Opinions like yours, or in the article, are the reason mentally ill people have such a bad reputation. There are millions of diagnosed and undiagnosed people that are not violent. Some are misdiagnosed and thus mis-medicated or under-medicated and so on. Some don’t go to get help because of the names like “insane” and “crazy” attached to them. And who do we have to blame for that? Who wants to be labeled like that? And about my meds… who’s to say I dont have a family member or a friend who is mentally ill? Maybe I’m a psychiatrist.
But, you are right, Billy, everyone is entitled to an opinion. Hypothetically, though, if someone was opinionated about your kids or something you cared about, would you not get a bit huffed about it? I thought everyone was entitled to get mad once in awhile too. Didn’t think you had to take medication for it.
Its funny. I came back to this site to apologize to those who have been commenting for what I said (which is to the author of the article) and I find your comment, Billy. There’s having an opinion and then there’s rude.
My thoughts are not only with the victims involved here, but also the shooter’s parents, how awful it must be for them to not only have to deal with the death of their son, but what he has done also.
For those who are ignorant to mental illness, there is a huge difference between “sick” and “evil”. Do your research before judging.
Thank you to all those people who are not stereotyping us South Koreans. I was born and raised here so I am an American, but to know someone with the same ethnic background who has harmed so many is just down right disgraceful. Knowing that, I hope that for those of you who decide to judge all of us South Koreans will think twice about who you decide to judge because then you’re no better than a damn racist. I really don’t mean to attack anyone and if you feel offended please e-mail me. My condolences to all the families and friends who have lost loved ones. God bless.
I guess I tend to over-simplify things! It doesn’t matter that this young man was Korean! He could have been of any race or ethnicity! It has been reported that he was a loner and had strange ways and wrote some VERY SCARY things. Being Asian alone, I’m SURE he has been taunted and ridiculed over the years; I hear it done every day at my work by SO-CALLED adults. There is SO MUCH hatred in this country! And I do believe that we now see what this can result in given the wrong individual! It is CERTAINLY no excuse for what he did………there IS no excuse………and NO ONE is to blame except himself! But the sooner we realize that we are ALL brothers and sisters, and we are ALL different in our own ways, not just by race or ethnicity, and that we ALL have problems and many of us could use a little understanding and help and that we ALL should take a good look in the mirror once in a while and should LISTEN to ourselves……….THINK ABOUT IT……….and don’t go getting all angry because you don’t agree with what I feel! What do I know………….I’m a middle-aged “white” father trying to raise two children to love and TRY to understand how people are the same yet different! Peace to you all and my sincerest sympathy to those who have been affected by this tragic tragic act. I hope they somehow find the will to go on! I don’t know how I could……….
Listen, if you’re laying the groundwork to blame society for the acts of this nut, don’t. I have a Korean wife and two half-Korean kids and the only place we’ve ever experienced racial animus was in Korea. Do kids tease each other? Sure. But the vast majority of Korean-Americans manage to become well-adjusted and productive members of our society by overcoming it. Please don’t transform all Korean-Americans into pychos OR hapless victims when either is really the other side of the same coin. We’re talking about one individual with some highly individualized issues here. Cho is neither representative or symptomatic of the larger group.
BTW, in response to an earlier comment, Cho’s family was apparently Christian, and he left behind a lot of anti-Christian comments in his final screed.
Well lets see and find out if he had killed any Koreans or Asians. But we all know living here that Koreans are very very very racist not all but most. Koreans go and protest against everything and blame the US Soldiers for it all. I see more Koreans beating up cab drivers in brod day light than anyone. How could you even put this shooting incident in the same breath as cabies getting beat up, funny. I don’t see cabbies dying in the streets, I don’t see Americans out there protesting against Koreans or even making a big ruccuss as it would have been if it would of happened here. Koreans would have started some fires and screamed Yankee go Home. How about Koreans go HOME for once……..
I’m just telling you what I see and hear, Joshua, and SOME people can only take so much, especially when they are somewhat unstable. Going back to my work, there is one young man who, JUST LIKE YOU, is married to a Korean and ALSO has two children! And this guy is ALWAYS making racial and ethnic remarks! I would think he would be a LITTLE MORE understanding. I’m NOT laying any groundwork! And I’m certainly not “transforming” anyone…….I’m just stating my own observations.
John, I think it’s one thing for you to expect Koreans to be less nationalistic (and often, flat-out racist) in how they deal with flawed individuals with different ethnic or cultural backgrounds. I think those demands are legitimate. But from your comment above, you don’t seem to be on a morally superior plane to that; you’re pretty much just a mirror image of it.
“are the reason mentally ill people have such a bad reputation.”
This gem and much more that I quickly skimmed over here and elsewhere is why I blogged today that I’m going to bury my head in the sand for a few days…..until the maddness ends….
It would be so nice if humanity could grow from events like this, but we’re just too screwed up….Like I said on my blog, trying to find something worthwhile to say or some ray of sunshine….I remembered back to the hysteria over cynide in Tylonal capsuls in the early 80s and how that led to the protective covers that are now standard on medicine bottles, drink containers, and a lot more. At least we can take a step forward from time to time in the face of a traumatic event…….
…..now……I’m going to go play ostrich…..see you guys in a couple of days…..
The shooter perhaps suffered from the side effects of anti-depressants, which ever one, they all do the similar balancing acts so to speak, also their could of been a prodromal phase in early onset Schizophrenia which he was going through. forget the gun control stuff, it does not pertain to this issue. Finding early symptoms of mental illness is the answer here. It’s all chemicals, not items that you can pick up and use to harm. It’s the mind.
That’s a sensible theory. I defended two cases in which my expert was prepared to testify that the medications the alleged victims suddenly quit taking, against medical advice, can cause people to experience extreme emotions and even delusional behavior.
I understand Cho was on some meds, but I’m not sure what or when.
A Korean living in Japan does not take a case of Virginia seriously at all.
A Korean living in Japan was Japanese, and the following comment translated the thing which they wrote in into English in most famous BBS “2ch” in Japan.
>I chase it, and a fool of excited 2ch unties it and thinks that the American media is exaggerated a little.
>For example, more than 40,000 a year American ã˜ã‚ƒ die of a traffic accident.
>I surpass 1,000 people on a day when I divide this by 365. I am no match for 30.
I introduce the comment that a Korean living in Japan one more wrote in at “2Ch”.
>I am disappointed, and there can be a thing feeling it by this shooting rampage.
>The Korean student was familiar with a hero if I did shooting rampage at a Japanese university.
>It fitted a hero handed down like the An Jung-geun that shot Hirofumi Ito to death eternally in Korea.
>Japan takes 1,000,000 Korean life with colonial rule and an aggressive war and charity dame-related slave.
>When I shot it to death, and 30 people compare it with the Japanese crime that they committed by> shooting rampage, there is too too little it.
>It is certain that the Korean student was received as a hero by Korea if the shooting rampage of> this time happened in Japan without committing suicide.
>Of the Korean student who failed to become a> hero pray its soul may rest in peace.
I feel very sad as a Korean neighbor.
C’mon, 2ch, are you really citing one anonymous commenter somewhere in Japan to support the idea that “Koreans” are minimizing this tragedy, ergo, somehow responsible for it?
Where have I heard reasoning like this before?
When I see anyone celebrating or minimizing this, I’ll be sure to denounce them without mercy — count on that.
It’s ironic that I started this site in some small part because of my anger at South Korea’s collective-guilt tarring of American soldiers as baby killers because of one frigging traffic accident. As one of those soldiers, I found that tarring deeply offensive because it was so false. Now I find myself defending “Koreans” against the same faulty and bigoted logic — including their own — and arguing that South Koreans (who do have other things to apologize and make amends for) have no reason to apologize for this. Certain South Koreans have been guilty of some very unfair and inflammatory anti-American scapegoating recently, which I initially worried could have played some role in this. Nothing we know now suggests that this played any role in this crime, however. Nor does it have much of anything to do with Korean-Americans.
Another point I want to make is that the term “Koreans” is being thrown about with extreme imprecision, and I’ve been as guilty as anyone here. Cho was a Korean national who appears to have grown up mostly in America. Culturally, he was somewhere between those two cultures, and he doesn’t seem to adapted to either. I think we should honor the distinction between Korean and American (such as Korean-Americans) in this discussion, because if we don’t, we dishonor the American-ness of people based on their ethnicity. Two of our society’s fundamental beliefs are its (albeit imperfect) neutrality toward ethnicity and its idea of individual responsibility for individual actions. If you give up those beliefs, we become a loose confederation of cohabitating tribes.
This crime was Cho Seung Hui’s fault and no one else’s.
And in response to an earlier comment: if you can’t use words like “crazy” and “insane” on an evil psychopathic mass murderer, hey, when can you use them?
[Updated]
Hi joshu,
feel consciousness of the shame that you have with normalcy really. If a criminal of Virginia case is a Japanese, I will feel consciousness of shame as the same race even if it is another person.
However, I tend to replace a problem secretly when it is the American gun society and sake of racial discrimination that woke up Virginia case not at first a Korean living in Japan agrees in BBS “2ch” which I introduced, and expressing consciousness and a condolence of shame as a race.
The comment that I can quote is enormous as well as these 2.
Joshua said, “Now I find myself defending “Koreans†against the same faulty and bigoted logic – including their own – and arguing that South Koreans (who do have other things to apologize and make amends for) have no reason to apologize for this. Certain South Koreans have been guilty of some very unfair and inflammatory anti-American scapegoating recently, which I initially worried could have played some role in this. Nothing we know now suggests that this played any role in this crime, however. Nor does it have much of anything to do with Korean-Americans.”
I agree with you wholeheartedly, Joshua, and that is why I, TOO, entered my comments here! I hope you realize that WE are ON THE SAME PAGE I think! I OFTEN find myself defending “minorities” because of so much hate and bigotry in this country/world! I just hope I have made a small difference in raising my OWN two children to see people as people and NOT as a races or nationalities! And, no, I don’t believe EITHER that this horrific act had ANYTHING TO DO with Korean-Americans; he was just a hate-filled, unstable young man who has hurt SO MANY!
To everyone here:
I, as an African American, whole-heartedly support South Korea and all Korean-Americans. Due to the fact that this crime was committed to minorities and majorities there is no, and I repeat NO reason to suggest that this crime had any reference to race. I have engrossed myself in all the information that I could get. I have seen an out pouring of condolences to America from South Korea almost immediately after it happened. Even though this act was only the fault of one sick man, those prayers were still put in place by the country many people want to blame. If you really look at where he spent majority of his life and decide to judge said country for it (for some estranged reason), the fall would have to be placed on the United States. I’m not saying that you need to blame an entire race of people, I’m trying to show that people are just trying to find an escape goat. There should be no reason that one should have to defend their country due to an act that was made by someone out of their right mind. Keeping in mind that he was mentally disturbed, I really don’t think race made him anymore angry than people in general. Most of his grievances were to “rich kids”(from his video clips sent in and his writings) among other random things. This was one disturbed individual, it had nothing to do with ANY country as a whole.
I love Asian culture. I have for a while and have planned to study overseas in Seoul next year. This event in no way has changed my mind. I hope that even with the backlash that might come to Koreans, Korean-Americans, or even Asians as a whole, there will also be an outpouring of support. If not, know that I will continue to support you and will try to change others opinions. Hopefully you can take my response to this situation with an open heart.
Tiffany
By the notes he wrote Maybe he was letting his anger flow out then. I’m assuming he was having trouble with his family, He was obviously disturbed and had problems. he was probably mistreated and possibly beaten. I do not think he had the chance to express his anger at home, afraid he was going to get more beatings. So he expressed his anger at school. There was probably a matter of money in his household. When he described “rich kids” in his note. angered at the fact they got to live good lives and he didn’t. well, that was only an assumption I had, I’m only in 5th grade, so…..chow!
If anyone is interested, here is a link to an article from the National Alliance for the Mentally Ill about Cho.
If it doesn’t work, go to http://www.nami.org and click on the big “VT” at the top. Or type Virginia Tech Tragedy in your search.
I have friends who are Japanese, Chinese, and Korean and I do enjoy their company, their humor, their food, their culture. I find nothing offensive about them. To think that a whole race/culture/nation is a particular way is being stereotypical. After all, the American population isn’t all “one way” in any ideation (or even culture or religion…). Why should we think that of others? That was for whoever made the cabbie comment. I can’t find your post again.
2ch:
Why don’t you just use 2ch’s preferred term for Koreans – hwabyeong ? Reading 2ch comments threads is like walking through a sewer.
Oh, BTW, 2ch, hwabyeong = kabyo (ç«ç—…).
im a proud korean
nd dont think tht all koreans are like cho seung hui.
for idiots tht dont noe, evry1 else tht killed in skool shootings
were WHITE. like the columbine, the amish, or even the texas killings. not black, not muslim, not asian, but white.
so dont go sayin tht koreans are gooks or theyre psycho,
cuz must pyscho killers happen to be white. im not sayin tht all white ppl r messed up, cuz theyre not.
but there r some ppl, from evry race, tht r just crazy.
hi
I would just like to add something. I am not blaming all…cause trust me…an evil person is an evil person no matter what race they are. But you ever notice if a black, asian, hispanic, arabic person is involved in a murder or something the whole race gets ridiculed? Not by all people mind you…just by those people who like to judge others. But honestly when a white person kills (I.E. columbine ), No one says anything about of was he english or german? An evil or maybe a disturbed person is just that. Anyways I pray for all the families and yes even the kids family as well. God bless.
The only one to blame for this tragedy is Cho. Millions perhaps billions of people on this world are abused or molested every year, but do they go out and kill 32 people, no. We don’t even know if Cho was abused. What we do know is that Cho was fucked up in the head and had no writing skills whatsoever. He killed this people to get noticed and famous. He accomplished his goal. Let us make sure he is famous for being an asshole and a pathetic writer rather than some poor little tragic figure that we should feel any sort of empathy for.
Bottom line: he couldn’t get laid, so he went berserk. He should have lived in a quiet little apartment and saved up some money to buy a call girl.
just would like to say my piece. I’m married to a Korean national and I can empathize with Korean people in American culture.
However, I don’t feel like this is a racial or cultural issue at all. end of story. It is however, a very tradgic event perhaps inspired by
by this American culture fueled by the media’s lust of “shock and awe” in order to bring in the most viewers for the sake of a dollar
I wish the media would quit stereotyping loners and shy people as the only types of people that end up being serial killers. Charles Manson, Ted Bundy, and Jim Jones were quite talkative, but they were serial killers. Also, don’t forget Hitler; he was a master at public speaking. Many of the greatest killers in history are actually people that are quite sociable. And many of the most shy withdrawn people are actually quite nice.
niceinmd, Tiffany, Joshua, chip, and John,
Thank you for your comments, it gave me a sense of reassurance to know there were “real” and “understanding” people out there instead of racist assholes. Well I whole heartedly support you guys and your thoughts. For those I named at the top, as well as anyone else who reads this, I am grateful that you are raising your kids to be loving and understanding people, way to go! The last comment from John stood out at me. ” wish the media would quit stereotyping loners and shy people as the only types of people that end up being serial killers”, this is very true and I agree with this as well. The media reall should stop implying the fact that he was a “loner” because other people out there today who do not have little of no companionship hear about this. What is the media telling them?, that yes you lonely people out there without friends are destined to become a killer. Now I don’t know about you guys, but I would hate to be stereotyped as a murderer or a hateful person, which is why I left a comment here in the first place. Well thanks for reading up on this and once again I send my condolences out to families and friends who have lost a loved one. God Bless.
P.S. One good thing that came out from all this is the fact that if you look at the slideshows on some websites of VT students, most of them are praying.*Flashback to 9/11 and the uniting of many believers*
Darn I made some grammatical mistakes, please forgive me, but hopefully everyone who reads it understands what I meant, if not please send me an email and I’ll try to clarify it up for you. godsaznsoldier@yahoo.com
[OFK: Comment deleted and commenter permanently blacklisted.]
One of my Korean friends emailed me to say sorry for his country. My friend knows that some Korean people think certain Americans are violent as if they are not capable of violence.
Any person, whatever color, male or female, can become violent for all kinds of reason.
You’re welcome, Paul! I’ll write more when I get rid of this virus that my son was so nice to give me but wanted to see where this was going! Good to see GOOD people out there; sometimes I wonder. And nice to see that those who just rant and rave get “blacklisted” (watch out Bob Jr………….you’re walking a fine line!).
I just love how this bigot has to take a potshot at Muslims/Middle Easterners/South Asians, when this horrible act was commited by one of his own.
[Pointless name-calling deleted by administrator]
Cyrus, please be specific in making your point, and lay off the name-calling.
i think what that cho guy did was good, he killed many innocent people, but the teachers will be afraid to abuse the student in future. i read what he wrote, he said he is sacrificing himself for all the weak and helpless guys. and its true. first i thought he was a monster but after i read what he wrote i can see the benefit of what he did. you see in our world people only respect one thing — strength. if you are big and tall everyone respect you, if you are small everyone treats you like shit. cho showed that small guys can turn nasty if pushed too far, and that will make people afraid to pick on small guys, especially students. innocent people died, that’s unfortunate. but the same thing happens in a war, innocent die in order to correct some other evil. cho was kicked out of poetry and literature class for his writing, he was a shy guy so when he tried to hit on a couple girls in a somewhat clumsy way they ratted on him. girls don’t have the guts to say “i am not interested, but thank you for asking†to guys they find unattractive, instead they pretend they like them, flirt with them, than behind their back they rat on them and backstab them. and misandrist men are all to happy carrying out their dirty duties falsely accusing a guy of harassment. sex discriminates against the ugly. they don’t realize that ugly guys are people too who also deserve to have fun and be happy. taking a kinder and gentler attitude towards all humankind might serve these pampered women with low self-esteem well. its easy to ridicule men, to blame men, to ignore men. but it is not easy to be a man. especially an ugly short man like cho. society prepares the crime the criminal commits it.
feminists and men who support gender biased, sexist, anti-male laws including the school system, police, justice system, and government are responsible for emasculation of men, which is the cause of the social anxiety among young men like cho. feminists would rather nitpick and close down a corporation which is supporting thousands of women who feed their babies because some guy hang a victoria’s secret angel over the time clock. its time women got over themselves and men stopped impersonating sentimental buffoons catering to their vile whims.
as for the media, its common sense that by rewarding cho with what he was aiming for – publicity they are sending the message that whoever kills a lot of people will be rewarded with publicity. why stop there? announce a bloody reward for the families of dead serial killers so you can get your bloody ratings. what do you expect from a society which is so utterly lacking in integrity? you are worse than the cho dude, you may be snug and secure behind your desks, but you are encouraging murder.
Kam,
I totally understand what you mean, but when you said “especially an ugly short man like cho” I thought that was kinda contradicting the point you were trying to make. lol. Well I was wondering if you could please post the link of his manifesto because I was eager to read and see what this guy was thinking.
Niceinmd, yeah it is nice to see there are good people out there and I’m glad to see comments that have been recently posted arn’t racist in anyway except that one “A real American” guy.
Once again my condolences to those families and friends who lost loved ones. God bless.
I do not understand why; when there are 20+ people in a room that they did not fight back; those guns ony hold x number of rounds. Why just stand/sit there and wait to be shot? It is human nature to protect yourself; 4-5 could have taken him out. He had to reload, change his position of sight/movement and that’s all it takes. Chances of getting shot/shot at was 100% so go down fighting! Too many kids today are “passive” when faced with agressive situations; survival is the “key” word. Seems this situation occurred on an airliner where the terrorists were “eliminated” and those individuals knew their chance of survival was zero.
Kam, Please seek counseling. I am not joking. I am absolutely serious.
Kam’s comment is really touching althouth there are some nonsene ideas in it. Korea is now more popular than ever.
I, myself is a loner. My condolences not only to the victims and their families but also to Cho Seung Hui.
Hmmm. Cho Seung Hui. It sounds very Korean. What if he had an english name? I think American media would have not put too much stress on his nationality.
Thank you and I do appreciate your concern for Korean community.
And please visit my cyworld at
http://www.cyworld.com/youhokyun
and add me in your msn messenger’s list
andy_144@hotmaila.com
Yes, certainly the most important message we should gain out of this tragedy is to have sex with ugly people, or they might go crazy and kill people.
QUOTE KAM:
feminists and men who support gender biased, sexist, anti-male laws including the school system, police, justice system, and government are responsible for emasculation of men, which is the cause of the social anxiety among young men like cho. feminists would rather nitpick and close down a corporation which is supporting thousands of women who feed their babies because some guy hang a victoria’s secret angel over the time clock. its time women got over themselves and men stopped impersonating sentimental buffoons catering to their vile whims.
END QUOTE
A bunch of crap. That doesn’t justify killing innocent people. Cho could have made friends with either/or non Koreans or Korean Americans. He could have went to the gym and made himself more manly. Society doesn’t make effeminate men. Men have a free will to be what they want. They are totally responsible for who they are.
Sure people bullied Cho but he could have changed his situation. He could have reacted to bullying with a positive attitude. However, he chose the “Blame other People” path. The murders are the end result of that path. I hate society and people so I will kill them.
I guess he felt nobody loved him. I can’t comment on that. That’s a spiritual or religious thing. I feel sorry for him in that regard. But hey what can I do? What can society do with a mad dog who kills people? Let him live?
I do thing this attack may have been karma for America. I’m very sad for the lost lives etc. However, British/American Imperalism killed natives in the USA, Canada, Australia, NZ and South Africa.
“The White Man’s Burden”. Now the murderers get a taste of thier own medicine. They feel some pain. Massacares are sad events for all people: white, black, yellow and brown.
Note: I’m targeting whites as a race not individuals. It’s the nature of man to be unjust to his fellow man. Every nation has people who contribute to the evil. So all and all we can say that murder is wrong. The murder of college students, Native American Tribes, Kwangju and No-Gun-Ri massacres and the murder commited by Communist and Fascist governments.
QUOTE KAM:
as for the media, its common sense that by rewarding cho with what he was aiming for – publicity they are sending the message that whoever kills a lot of people will be rewarded with publicity. why stop there? announce a bloody reward for the families of dead serial killers so you can get your bloody ratings. what do you expect from a society which is so utterly lacking in integrity? you are worse than the cho dude, you may be snug and secure behind your desks, but you are encouraging murder.
END QUOTE
I 100 percent agree with you Kam on that point. The movie “Natural Born Killers” exposes how American society and media glorifies murder. People shouldn’t do that. The kid should never be made into a hero. However, we can see that massacres are bad and that westerners (and those working for them) have commited many massacres. We can also look at this kid and take notes. We don’t see a hero just a foolish kid with an broken heart.
People have a free will. However, people cannot control some aspects of thier environment. For example, people may not be able to stop a comet from hitting the Earth. However, people can control thier reaction to the comet.
Cho Seung Hui could not control some aspects of his environment (the bullies, etc..) However, he could determine his reaction to his environment.
Einstien believed in total pre-determinism. He believed people were not responsible for thier actions. However, I only partially agree with pre-determinism.
Question Marks…
“This didn’t have to happen”, Cho Seung-Hui said, after brutally murdering thirty-two people at Virginia Tech University.
And this terrible tragedy of sons, daughters, mothers and fathers didn’t have to happen, if we’d only listened.
But we never listen.
We never listen to those that are different from us- the outcasts, the lonely, the homeless, the ones that are unspoken for. We don’t try to understand. We shun them and put them out of our minds because of our fear that we will become like them.
And these people become more and more lonely and alienated in their isolation.
Words like “creep”, “deranged misfit” and “psycho” devalue this killer’s humanity so we don’t have to face how similar he is to us. Cries of “how could he have been stopped” are uttered by media quick to sensationalize and gain market share, when the words “how could he have been listened to” are never considered.
Because we don’t want to listen.
We don’t want to hear about loneliness and alienation when we’re all so busy with our lives, making money and making friends. And the unpopular, the ones that don’t fit in, the lonely ones are ignored or made fun of because we don’t care to understand anything about them.
As a boy, Cho Seung-Hui “was picked on, pushed around and laughed at over his shyness” (Associated Press). When he started college, according to the Guardian, “his mother took his dormitory mates to one side to explain about her son’s unusual character and implored them to help.”
And he clearly needed help, devaluing himself so much that he called himself “Question Mark”.
There are more “Question Marks” out there. There are millions of them. And if we don’t listen to them, they will follow the same path again and again, because people are not connecting. We are becoming more and more disconnected from each other, creating more and more “Question Marks” every day.
Most “Question Marks” don’t become murderers. Some just kill themselves. Most harm no one and live just as we do, needing antidepressants to appear what we call “normal”. They may be someone you know, someone you love.
This “Question Mark” was once a little boy, who cried, and smiled and loved, He wanted to fit in just like you and I. But that desire to fit in transformed itself into anger towards a society that shunned and ignored him.
How many more times will we shun and ignore the one that doesn’t fit in, the one in the corner, the one that’s different? When all we have to do is listen, before it’s too late.
But we won’t.
Thirty-two human beings who did not know Cho Seung-Hui were murdered.
They were sons, daughters, fathers and mothers, with dreams of futures that will never come and children that will never be born. The thirty-two leave behind people that love them. People that are now scarred for life by this horrible day of death.
To most of us that have not been directly involved, this tragedy will become a memory and fade like all the others that came before.
And the “Question Marks” will appear with more frequency, again and again, because we don’t listen.
We never do.
—————
http://www.x-thc.com
Fetch my violin (sniff).
I think you’re trying to shift blame to the rest of society when this s.o.b. was a capable of hopping off the crazy train on any number of occasions. I got teased in school, too, and I’d venture that goes for most people. This kid didn’t deal, the way most people learn to do. He didn’t seek counseling, he didn’t stay on his medication, and then he made a whole series of decisions to plan, prepare, and carry out murder.
x-thc has been plastering that cut and paste litter on several blogs. Reminds me of all those restaurant stickers cluttering up hallways and utility poles in Korea.
ok simple. I have been a freak. One of those people that loves piercings tatoos etc… I wear my hair in blue black purple red orange whatever suits me. I read an article and i agree. We as the freethinkers or people who just want to be our selves get trampled on. Conform conform conform. It goes back to the model ideal of beauty in american society. And what’s socially acceptable. His statement of you and your mercedes means he probably was either poor or middleclass. Or the other possibility a sensitive spirit that saw the suffering of others and took a path instead of mother terressa; he took the path of violence forcing this into other’s faces to basically shatter thier lives and make them say hey we’re only going to take it for so long. Much the same as the la riots but on a more personal and individual scale. We freaks namely myself and those dressed in black and chains etc have been beaten simply for what we wear to school. I got beaten up on my back on the buses more times than I care to remember. Goth guys got called queers and other derogatory sexual terms just cause of our clothes. Some where in the back of his brain his conscious mind thought…
“ok if i can kill enough of the preppy bastards then perhaps i’ll affect enough of the rich bastards lives that they’ll finally take notice.”
Further in the back of his mind i think also a part of him said..
“Fine they want to hate us and fear us because of what we wear and listen to and things we like that are different from the norm of society. Fine I’ll give them a reason to fear. Let’s see how many survivors say “hey halloween is over freak! get a life” etc…”
my quotes on his thoughts not any in documents etc…
In short it is very tragic. But having been through it and yes I don’t think until now how many people finally realize just how brutal american highschools are for the freak,gay,bi communties. Cause a ton of people have thought of this. The only difference is as one thing I have read on it said. We all had our reasons. Friends that are freaks that might get hit instead of our targets. Teachers we actually liked. Anything to disuade us from it. Including jail time. But sometimes when you have no girlfriend or true friends. When you’ve been betrayed. When you’re tired of being abused just because of the things you enjoy you snap and slah your wrists. Or instead he snapped and metaphorically speaking slashed the wrist of those around him. Ending thier lives instead of his own. And he knew like most he didn’t wish to die as a villain or be locked away forever since he was most likely a free spirit that just wanted someone. So he ended his life both out of fear of being villified and out of fear of retribution and the laws.
Jesues Christ this makes me sick. I see so many say he could have done this or he could have done that. Go to a gym and work out become more manly.. WTF?! Why do we have to conform to your ideals as a whole to be loved. And one thing that ticks me off about most not all but most christians is the fact that if i’m wearing a pentacle (not the inverted pentagram which is also a misunderstood statement they by deffinition are the same but the upside down version) Why the heck am I suddenly beneath you. I wear black so i must be evil or rude? If I’m fat I don’t care about myself and aren’t worth your time? WTF?! Apathy plain and pure apathy is what society has created. What freaks use “I’m me don’t like it tough deal with it” attitude. Normal society not all but alot has reversed into thier own twisted version. “You’re not like me. I can stand you tough I don’t want to know you. So deal with it.” attitude.
Come on! Open your eyes. It took 10 years and me finally being out of highschool to see norms and freaks taking parts from each others culture finally. I see preps and norms with eyebrow rings. When I was in highschool that could and did get me beaten. Now it’s ok. The world is changing slowly. And sometimes it takes violence. It sucks but it’s true. My condolences to the families. Apathy isn’t just not caring. It’s callousness and sarcasm also.
So we learn that we must go out and have sex with fat ugly people…
God give me a break.
No the moral is drop the bigotry, drop the stereotypes, and for christ sake look at something other than people’s appearance. Simple… This one thing makes all the difference.
Listen to us. Don’t look at us. But listen to us…