KCNA: Ling and Lee Filmed Themselves Entering North Korea (Updated, Bumped)
[Original post, 16 Jun 09]
I’ll certainly reserve judgment until we see the videotape and until Ms. Ling and Ms. Lee can freely authenticate it, but if that’s true, it would be, well, stupid, even if it were done with the purpose of informing us about an important issue:
“We’ve just entered a North Korean courtyard without permission,” the Korean translation of their narration on the videotape said, according to KCNA. One of them picked up and pocketed a stone as a memento of the illegal move, the report said. [AP]
Again, I emphasize that this is KCNA we’re talking about. Even if we see video, I’d need to be convinced that it wasn’t staged after the fact.
At the same time, North Korea is also dispensing with the idea that it sentenced these women to twelve years in a labor camp not so much for the misdemeanor of crossing the border, but because of the subject matter on which they dared to report:
North Korea said Tuesday that two convicted U.S. journalists admitted to crossing its border with China and shooting video for a smear campaign against Pyongyang over its human rights conditions.
The official Korean Central News Agency released a detailed report “laying bare the facts about the crimes committed by the American journalists,” Chinese-American Laura Ling, 32, and Korean-American Seung-Un Lee, 36, who are reporters for the San Francisco-based Current TV.
“At the trial the accused admitted that what they did were criminal acts committed, prompted by the political motive to isolate and stifle the socialist system of the DPRK (North Korea) by faking up moving images aimed at falsifying its human rights performance and hurling slanders and calumnies at it,” the report said. [Yonhap News]
One should never presume that any official North Korean statement is true, but if it is, then an appropriate punishment for stupidity is no more than 30 days in jail and a good scare. The actual punishment for reporting the truth about North Korea’s atrocities, on the other hand, appears to be much more severe. Such things must be discouraged at all costs.
How long do you suppose it will be before we see more of Barbara Demick’s reporting from the border regions, or more documentaries like the heartbreaking BBC/Chosun Ilbo collaboration, “On the Border?” If there aren’t, it’s because terrorism works. And unless President Obama is willing to encourage more of it, he must hold North Korea accountable. Hey, don’t take it from me, take it from Tom Plate, no less. Plate is now questioning every reason why I’ve spent the last five years not reading him. Good for Tom Plate for being honest enough to do so.
Update: What KCNA’s report and Flickr pages tell us, but first, the Committee to Protect Journalists responds:
“These two journalists were convicted after a trial that was not open to international observers. There has been no transparency in the way North Korea has treated them and this report does not mitigate our concerns about their well-being,” said Bob Dietz, CPJ Asia program coordinator. “At the same time we are hopeful that these latest developments pave the way for the release of these journalists on humanitarian grounds.” [link]
I wish I shared their optimism. This plot has thickened.
Oh, and the original KCNA report, has some interesting details. For one thing, KCNA says the episode took place near Onsong (Google Earth images here), which is very far downstream on the Tumen River and not a place where I’d think the river would run dry in any time of year. I searched for images of the river border from as many different times of year as possible; here’s what it looks like in July, August, August, October, October, autumn, and in winter, when hell really does freeze over. None shows the river running dry, and it seems unlikely — though not impossible — that it would still have been completely frozen over and safe to cross in March.
What does this tell us? For one thing, I think we can rule out the possibility of an accidental crossing.
Another, more surprising, fact we learn from tourists’ Flickr pages is that apparently, tourists and Chinese boatmen have been fairly casual about floating right up to and photographing the North Korean side of the river in that area, including border guard posts. Would I do it? Hell, no. But apparently, this was an established practice in that region. If Ms. Ling and Ms. Lee merely floated up to the North Korean bank of the river, then for some reason, North Korea chose that particular time and those particular women to change the rules.
KCNA’s report mentions nothing of a boat, but it seems unlikely the women would have crossed the river in that area without one. I see just three possibilities: either they crossed the river intentionally (stupid if true, but hardly a proven fact); they floated up to the North Korean side with a video camera and were nabbed there (an excusable indiscretion, in light of past practice); or they were abducted and taken across (international kidnapping, hardly unprecedented for the North Koreans, but also not proven here).
As usual, there are some curious word choices in KNCA’s translation:
The investigation proved that the intruders crossed the border and committed the crime for the purpose of making animation files to be used for an anti-DPRK smear campaign over its human rights issue.
The preliminary investigation proved that they had a confab on producing and broadcasting a documentary slandering the DPRK with Mitch Koss, executive producer of programming of the Current TV, David Neuman, president of programming, and David Harleston, head of the Legal Department of Current TV, and other men in Los Angeles, U.S. in January.
A trial of the accused was held at the Pyongyang City Court from June 4 to 8.
At the trial the accused admitted that what they did were criminal acts committed, prompted by the political motive to isolate and stifle the socialist system of the DPRK by faking up moving images aimed at falsifying its human rights performance and hurling slanders and calumnies at it. [KCNA]
Whether the words “animation” and “moving images” represent some indecipherable and preposterous claim, or whether this is just typically stilted KNCA translation is difficult to say. What is clear is that the “crime” of which Ms. Ling and Ms. Lee were really sentenced wasn’t so much the alleged crossing of the river but the anticipated content of the report, as revealed by Ling and Lee under North Korean interrogation.
The report ends with this cryptic statment:
We are following with a high degree of vigilance the attitude of the U.S. which spawned the criminal act against the DPRK.
Translation: The price of their freedom is ransom and censorship.
Update, 18 Jun 09: The Joongang Ilbo reports on the arrest of Ling and Lee’s “ethnic Korean” guide, although the report answers none of our most important questions about the circumstances of the arrest:
Chun Ki-won, a Christian pastor and human rights activist, said the guide, Kim Seong-cheol, was arrested in China after he managed to evade North Korean guards on March 17, the day Euna Lee and Laura Ling were caught near the China-North Korea border on the Tumen River while reporting on North Korean refugees.
“I believe the Chinese arrested Kim to question him about the journalists’ situation,” said Chun, who declined to provide further, personal details on Kim. [Joongang Ilbo]
This detail does seem less likely that Kim was a North Korean agent:
Chun said he introduced Kim to Lee and Ling, journalists for the San Francisco-based Current TV, upon their request in January.
“Current TV wanted to send Caucasians on this reporting trip,” Chun recalled. “But I told them reporting on refugees had to be carried out in secret and having Caucasians would make them stand out.
Chun said he arranged meetings with refugees for the journalists. “I told them never to cross the border,” he said.
The pastor added Lee, who was “fluent in Korean,” called him twice a day to provide him with updates. Lee and Ling were sentenced to 12 years of hard labor on June 8 for their illegal entry.
If Kim was working for the North Koreans, the North Koreans would already have paid him to give them Chun himself. Chun, for all his faults, is cagey enough to have outsmarted the North Koreans and the Chinese for many dangerous years, despite having become a major irritant to both governments. To me, that means (contrary to what one source had told me) that the North Koreans probably did not lure Ling and Lee to their capture. I hope for Kim’s sake that he’s not a North Korean himself. If he is, the Chinese will send him across the border, where he’d have a very bleak future.
@Spelunker:
Are you a journalist? If so, you don’t seem to work for a major news organization since you don’t have easy access to a Korean translator. As a school teacher on summer break, I have too much time on my hands. I will search around today for interviews with Euna Lee’s parents and other related news.
Honestly, I can’t believe the bulk of our attention is directed at ferreting out info about the crossing and where the two were first taken — turning over every stone and trying to figure out who to put pressure on to find out “the truth” — while the women are still being held and have just been sentenced to a long prison term in NK’s gulag.
Honestly, wouldn’t it be better to talk about formulating strategies for putting pressure on different groups to use their influence to get the two freed? — campaigns to get the media to talk more about their plight and NK’s hellish oppression? campaigns to contact key members of Congress? Al Gore? — whoever we think can help push the US government to do more than just sit patiently and wait for Pyongyang’s next move?
The fact the two are still being held with no end remotely in sight means much more than where they were initially taken…
But here’s the deal–why is the US Gov’t going to rescue them, when their own company seems unable or unwilling to admit what’s going on? If they broke the laws of North Korea, stupid as we may think those laws are, the US has to take a different tactic than it would if they were kidnapped while in China.
The sentence is out of proportion to the alleged crime, as I’m sure most people reading and commenting on this agree.
The federal government has rather bigger issues facing it vis-a-vis NK than just these two women.
Getting the media more involved would require Current TV to open up as well. And until that happens, I think speculation will continue. Maybe Gore’s working behind the scenes, round the clock, with some delicate negotiations. It would be nice to think so.
What she said.
Focusing attention on whether the two reporters “broke the laws” of North Korea might be good if the US government wants to ditch any connection with them – which maybe it does – which it probably does since the initial reaction out of the US in Seoul was that the two women were stupid and a distraction.
But if disdain for the plight of the women is not the primary US government position, the way it has handled the situation so far – and the large amount of attention being placed on the “broke the laws” or not issue outside of government circles – helps Pyongyang significantly.
It basically creates a no lose – all win situation for the regime:
North Korea is using the two women as pawns for propaganda and other purposes.
The US shutting its mouth about them isn’t going to make that go away.
Focusing most of our attention on whether they crossed the border or not isn’t going to change that. It might make us feel less concerned about the plight of the two women or not. But it won’t do more than just adjust our own feelings about the case.
It will not change NK’s program at all. We simply help the rest of the world accept that program or not based on how much attention we focus on the border crossing issue.
The US has more on its plate?
Sure. This is a helpful line of thinking if our ultimate purpose is to justify the US disconnecting itself from the plight of these two Americans.
I doubt it does much beyond that.
In the border scheme of things, NK successfully holding two American reporters in its gulag is just another item in North Korea’s playbook that makes it look stronger than it actual is and makes the US and others weaker than they actually are:
NK is testing nuclear weapons at its own whim.
It is conducting necessary ICBMs to help it in developing the capacity to toss its nukes anywhere on the planet.
It is now carrying out illegal shipments of arms, drugs, counterfeit dollars, or other illicit cargo within full view of the world media who also get to watch US military ships just tracking them…
…i wonder if the Korean crew has bothered sticking out their tongues or mooning the American crews yet?….
And what has the US led the world to do in response to any or the total of all of this?
Jackpoo…
If the US were making significant progress on disarming North Korea or getting it to reform — and the case of these two reporters was in serious danger of upsetting that progress — then I’d say toss the two aside as a distraction and try to minimize the world’s attention on them…
…..but we have nothing in the way of progress and I can’t think of any reasonable argument that can be made that the case of these two reporters is significantly hampering progress.
In fact, I’d think a better case could be made that highlighting their plight to catch global attention would help the US apply more effective pressure on Pyongyang that will benefit other things like actually backing up UN sanctions on nukes and ICBMs with effective pressure. — by putting China and Russia in a hotter position for blocking such effective pressure.
We are showing we don’t really care about the two American citizens – and I don’t see how that helps strengthen the US position on 6 party talks, nukes, ICBMs or anything…
We are just proving here (and elsewhere) we won’t do more than complain and sign another useless piece of paper at the UN each time the North tests a nuke or ICBM.
We are making ourselves look largely impotent and making it seem North Korea is calling all the shots and is the one with plenty of room to maneuver.
So, again — if it helps the US government and others feel better about the nothing we are currently doing in the face of North Korean provocations, then they can focus on the “illegal acts” of these two all they want – and they can ghost-shadow NK’s illegal cargoes and do photo ops with Hans Blix signing yet another UN resolution condemning NK for its provocations. They should have this stuff on form-letters by now…where they can just plug in new dates the next time the North tests an ICBM…
The US has bigger issues on its plate, but that doesn’t mean ignoring the North’s actions in regards to these two Americans makes sense.
It would be very bad if the US allowed Pyongyang to tie releasing these two with lessoning sanctions or doing something incredibly stupid like taking them off the state sponsors of terrorism list — oh, we already did that for basically nothing…
But largely ignoring the North’s actions with these two Americans does not help ANY US position in the larger areas – nukes, ICBMs, nuke programs, 6 party talks, whatever…
Ignoring the two reporters or focusing our attention on the laws they broke just takes the heat off the US and North Korean governments.
NK still comes away looking strong and the US weak –
and as a long term bonus, it has two Americans it can parade around on international news reports anytime it feels like it in the future to remind the world how much power it has and how Washington can’t do anything about it….
I know its just being childish, but I’m starting to wonder if the State Department would have gone through more trouble if these two reporters had been college students trying to smuggle hashish out of Turkey?
@Sonagi
I am not a journalist. My only Korean interpreter is “Google Translate” Thank you very much for your kind offer to help. I tried to use Google translate with the Nambuk Story blog recommended by “The Korean” at “Ask The Korean”, but the article’s format does not allow copy and paste. “The Korean” translated one paragraph for me, and now I’m hungry for more:
http://www.journalog.net/nambukstory/13801
I was able to Google translate the comments section and am interested in this one by the blog’s author:
ë„ë§ì¹œ 남ìžëŠ” 중êµì¸¡ ê°€ì´ë“œì™€ 여기ìžë“¤ê³¼ ê°™ì€ íšŒì‚¬ì—ì„œ ì¼í•˜ëŠ” ë™ë£Œì˜€ìŠµë‹ˆë‹¤. 지금쯤 미êµì— ëŒì•„ê°€ ì •ë³´ë‹¹êµì— ìƒì„¸í•œ ìƒí™©ì„ 해설해 ì£¼ì—ˆì„ ê²ƒìž…ë‹ˆë‹¤. ì €ì˜ íŒë‹¨ìœ¼ë¡œëŠ” ì´ë²ˆ 경우는 확실히 여기ìžë“¤ì´ 조심하지 ëª»í•˜ê³ ë¬´ëª¨í•œ í–‰ë™ì„ í–ˆë˜ ì¸¡ë©´ì´ ìžˆë‹¤ê³ ìƒê°í•©ë‹ˆë‹¤.
He often uses the word 여기ìžë“¤ (yeogija?), which Google somehow is not able to translate
into English so I would like to know what that means as well. Anyway, the fact that somebody claims to have interviewed one of the border sentries involved in arresting Laura and Euna fascinates me. Is this interview featured in any other Korean media? Now that the name of the local guide (ê¹€ì„±ì² Kim Sung-chul) in Yanji is known in South Korea , have there been any more articles on his background or current whereabouts? I can do a Google search with the Korean hangul of the guide’s name and see plenty of long articles, such as this recent one by the respectable Yonhap News Agency:
http://www.yonhapnews.co.kr/politics/2009/06/16/0505000000AKR20090616204900014.HTML?template=2086
Thank you very much, Sonagi! ì •ë§ ê°ì‚¬í•©ë‹ˆë‹¤.
@Belinda
I have previously posted information at ROK Drop about what’s going on behind the scenes to release Laura and Euna. The problem with Gore, in North Korea’s view, is that he is not a current member of Obama’s administration. That’s from a South Korean professor at the University of North Korean Studies.
http://www.thenational.ae/article/20090619/FOREIGN/706189884/1015/NEWS
A quotation from South Korea’s Foreign Minister during a Korean press conference on June 7 gives offers more insight:
Q: What is the probability of former U.S. Vice President Al Gore visiting Pyongyang to negotiate the release of two American female journalists?
Yu: It seems that the U.S. government is discussing whether to tackle the issue directly or have the private sector deal with it. If similar precedents of American figures paying cash to North Korea in exchange for release of U.S. citizens in custody are taken into account, we could imagine Gore visiting North Korea. I personally expect he will limit negotiations to the humanitarian agenda of the journalists’ release, rather than take advantage of the chance for political talks with the North.
So from those 2 seperate sources I would deduce that Obama has been ready to send Gore but North Korea insists on getting somebody else to talk about more than just humanitarian issues.
Try to think of it like two kids trading baseball cards:
Obama: Yo Kim, I’ll give you Gore for the 2 girls.
Kim: No way, I want Hillary say yo.
Obama: Yo? You can’t have Hillary. How about Bill?
Kim: Bill Clinton?
Obama: No, your old pal Bill Richardson!
Kim: No good; Me want somebody big say yo!
Obama: Wait a second, I’ve got somebody really big who wants to talk to you.
Arnold: “YO! How vould you like zee TerMEEnator? This is da governor of CaLEEfornia.”
Kim: Schwarzenegger say yo?
Arnold: Yes, I said “Yo”. This is Awnold and I vant zee 2 girls !
@USinKorea
Never mind. This comment is already long enough.
@Spelunker:
I looked around the Korean media and couldn’t even find the full names or photos of Euna Lee’s parents, nevermind any quotes or interviews.
여기ìžë“¤ = women reporters (ì—¬= female; 기ìž= reporter; 들=plural suffix)
I will check out the Yonhap link and do a little Googling and Navering today or tomorrow and pass along any informative links.
I was going to translate the comment, but I have a sneaky feeling you already know what it means. In fact, I’m starting to get the feeling you might be fluent in Korean.
BTW, if you’re not fluent in Korean, you might consider using Yahoo Babelfish instead. It translated 여기ìžë“¤ as “woman reporters.”
Being able to establish the facts, independently of the North Korean press release, might have been the first move for Current-TV working with the State Dept. If North Korea had kidnapped the two, State might have more to work with, but if their own zeal/inepititude got them arrested–esp. if their bosses at Current knew of this plan in advance, well, maybe Current needs to start dealing with this, esp. a well timed bribe/ransom/fine might pay off, instead of waiting for the Obama adminstration to rescue them.
A lot has changed since Midnight Express was in the multiplex. The NYT reporter, kidnapped in Afghanistan, escaped. The US government wasn’t doing anything for him, either, and the NYT wasn’t publicizing it.
http://www.nytimes.com/2009/06/21/world/asia/21taliban.html?_r=2&hp
I’m not suggesting that Ling and Lee do the same, but I’m do wonder about the blog world drum beat of “Obama/Hillary/Gore DO Something!” when Current-TV is the corporate enitity that should be addressed.
I wanted to highlight more clearly an idea from the longer comment today, because I’ve been thinking about it and it does seem key:
The 6 party talks and all other “diplomatic” efforts with NK are dead in the water and have been for a few months.
In fact, Obama seems to be pointing US NK policy in the direction of confrontation rather than appeasement.
There is no progress at all on the broader issues that can be derailed by the US focusing major attention on the plight of these two reporters.
In fact, if the US government could get the world press to make the plight of the two reporters a hot issue — it could help Obama be more effective in the other pressure points he is trying to use.
The only way focusing on the plight of these two reporters could negatively influence the US approach on the nuke and missile and other issues is —
— if the US were stupid enough to grant the North concessions on those other issues solely for releasing the two reporters. — and that isn’t likely to happen.
I never studied Korean. I was able to isolate the guide’s name through a tedious process of elimination on Google Translate. I have a very rough idea of what the comment means through Google translate’s mumbo jumbo, but was hoping for a more accurate translation from an intelligent person that can read Hangul.
ë„ë§ì¹œ 남ìžëŠ” 중êµì¸¡ ê°€ì´ë“œì™€ 여기ìžë“¤ê³¼ ê°™ì€ íšŒì‚¬ì—ì„œ ì¼í•˜ëŠ” ë™ë£Œì˜€ìŠµë‹ˆë‹¤. 지금쯤 미êµì— ëŒì•„ê°€ ì •ë³´ë‹¹êµì— ìƒì„¸í•œ ìƒí™©ì„ 해설해 ì£¼ì—ˆì„ ê²ƒìž…ë‹ˆë‹¤. ì €ì˜ íŒë‹¨ìœ¼ë¡œëŠ” ì´ë²ˆ 경우는 확실히 여기ìžë“¤ì´ 조심하지 ëª»í•˜ê³ ë¬´ëª¨í•œ í–‰ë™ì„ í–ˆë˜ ì¸¡ë©´ì´ ìžˆë‹¤ê³ ìƒê°í•©ë‹ˆë‹¤.
Google Translate’s official translation:
The man escaped with Chinese guide and yeogija work was in the same company. Now go back to the U.S. authorities detailed information will be picked haeseolhae situation. I definitely believe that this case was reckless yeogija they are not careful, I think the side.
Now here is Yahoo Babelfish’s baffling translation of the same comment:
Escape the man whom hits with the Chinese side guides and the woman reporters was the colleague who works from the same company. Goes back to the now about United States and to explain the situation which is detailed in information authorities. This case positively the woman reporters do not take care with secret intention judgment not to be able, is rash thinks that there is a side which acts.
Yahoo Babelfish has the capability to translate entire web pages, but once again the Nambuk Story blog is completely Babel-proof. I then tried inserting the Yonhap News Agency link that I posted above into Yahoo Babel-Fish and got the following babble:
The tablecloth “us the United States an anti-communism soup criminal act buys the time of birth height confronts specially from end and to have awaking sharply, is staring, revealed “.
The North America negotiation for a woman reporters release is started North Korea with the defector from North Korea and North Korea human rights problematic collection of data of these woman reporter “is same as for the US government which is a recurrence prevention guarantee of anti-communism soup criminal act ” accommodates about the US government, the possibility which will put out a difficult demand.
The secret process border entrance and exit crime application = two woman reporters 6:00 a.m. March 17th big [len] received the guidance of the Kim sage whom thousand pastors introduce with a [thu] TV program production bringing up for discussion director American course together and two which freezes after entering to the opposite side North Korea riverside, photographed a circumference with the telerecording camera, the tablecloth explained a peace from door city monthly contract position.
I think the Yonhap link is an article about the KCNA report of the trial. I would still be interested in finding out if there is an article in Korean media on Euna Lee and her parents in South Korea. If the captive female video editor was a Japanese-American journalist whose parents still live in Japan then I can guarantee that NHK, Asahi, Yomiuri, and others would be camped outside the poor parents house.
Why is it when eldest son Kim Jong Nam goes to Macau it seems that only Japanese media are following him around asking questions in English? Where are the aggressive reporters from America, Britain, South Korea, Hong Kong, etc.? I think it’s a real shame.
I searched using both Google and Naver yesterday and could not find even a mention of the parents’ names or their photos, nevermind any interviews.
Do you think it would do any good if Euna Lee’s parents in South Korea made a televised plea for compassion like the Ling family did in America? Is there a paparazzi news show on South Korean TV that would try contacting Euna’s parents or do they have too much respect for people’s privacy? I wonder if Euna was allowed to call her parents before the trial, or if she was only permitted one call and used it on her husband in California.
No, I do not think public pleas for leniency would do any good. The North Koreans certainly aren’t going to respond, and TV images of tearful parents might do more harm than good. If Belinda is correct, people stateside are pressuring the US goverment to “do something.” Now that the North Koreans have gotten whatever intel was available on the media storage devices and through interrogations, the two journalists are of no value to them except as bargaining chips. The women are of no strategic value to the US government, which is responding out of humanitarian concern. This means the North will have to accept whatever it can get and in the meantime, it would gain nothing by harming its hostages. Current TV and/or the US government can deal more effectively with the North Korean government with less public pressure to “do something.” As the plight of the women slips from the headlines, their value as a bargaining chip decreases. The North will periodically issue media releases to revive the story, but time is on our side.
From there down in Songi’s last comment — it could be true, but it isn’t the only viable interpretation of the situation. In fact, the exact opposite could also be true:
The North Korean regime is a megalomaniacal one that frequently does things that don’t make sense compared to how much of the world operates.
For example, who would have predicted, or can make sense of, North Korea sending military patrol boats to shoot it up with South Korean patrol boats in the West Sea just because South Korea was hosting the World Cup?
The one woman’s sister made an international fool out of the regime by daring to come into the country undercover and then create a much watched documentary lambasting the Dear Leader and his regime.
— That is easily more than enough motivation for a regime like that to want to harm both women and actually keep them in the gulag for the time specified or death, whichever comes first.
I think you can even consider a realistic scenario of motivation to harm the women that doesn’t include that sister:
It is a given that the regime has taken note of the handful of documentaries that have been done the last ten years and noted that some of the most compelling elements in them has come from reporters and NGOs doing exactly what these two reporters were doing on the border – and that those documentaries has damned the regime in the eyes of millions around the world.
That is more than enough incentive for a regime like Pyongyang to harm these women – both as some kind of misguided payback at the other documentary and news footage makers not even connected to these two particular women — but also as a way to warn would-be border filmers to stay away.
Just in that alone, it calls into question the idea quoted above — “it would gain nothing by harming its hostages.”
That is why I haven’t liked the “go silent” approach by the US government from the start:
Given that chance the regime might be inclined to do harm to these two women, showing indifference on the part of Washington makes the chance the North will decide to harm them much higher.
If Washington had come out strong from the start saying it took the plight of these women very seriously, the North would have had to think twice before it did anything to them in the form of torture.
Seeing Washington doesn’t care makes it easier for Pyongyang to decide to take revenge or send a message to other would-be filmers.
The line of thinking in Sonagi’s last comment makes sense if the two women are only chips to be negotiated away — that they are just something the North wants to make a profit on.
But I can’t rest assured that a regime like North Korea has proven itself to be time and time again in the past —- doesn’t consider the two are more than just a cash cow.
I can easily picture an outcome in which, once the North sees that it isn’t going to gain as much as it would like out of the US regarding the two, it will decide to do things with them based on other motivations it likely has…
That’s my fear in a nutshell — and why I’ve been advocating the US government make a big deal out of them being held.
….and secondarily, I also see putting pressure on NK on this issue could help the US in other areas — where it is trying to pressure the North in general. The idea being that the more heat the North faces on a string of issues, the better the chance we have of forcing them to reform in key areas…
Indifference only seems to make sense if we believe that the North will quickly hand the two women over once it sees it can’t gain money and resources for holding them.
It only makes sense if you believe that the two women are going to be released no matter what.
To me, that is a gamble.
I can easily picture these two women being held for years and even never being heard from again.
The North is the kind of regime that kidnaps Japanese citizens using submarines and commandos just to teach its spies the Japanese language and customs.
Then years later, stubbornly holds onto some of these abductees despite Japan’s willingness to pay to get them back.
How hard is it to imagine that Pyongyang might in fact decide to keep a hold on these two women?
And isn’t it more likely that indifference and silence from Washington will make holding them and torturing them easier for Pyongyang to do???
Public silence is not the same as indifference.
As much as I feel for the plight of these women and their families, I do not consider the imprisonment of these two journalists a top priority for the State Department. It is first and foremost a problem for Current TV to solve. North Korea’s recent nuclear developments are a far more important concern demanding immediate attention from our government.
While the National Geo. doc no doubt did embarrass the North Korean government, it wasn’t a huge attention getter in the US. Here’s a site that thinks that Laura’s being punished for Lisa. http://theparis-sf.com/did-north-korea-arrest-laura-ling-for-her-sister%E2%80%99s-documentary/
True. But, what are the chances Pyongyang will take public silence as indifference? Fairly high, I’d think.
But, how is paying attention and making an issue out of the holding of these two women going to hamper progress on the nuke issue?
It certainly won’t stymie any progress currently underway – because there is none.
All approaches to Pyongyang are dead in the water, and we have every reason to believe that the Obama administration has in mind to take a tougher line with Pyongyang.
How could making an issue of the two reporters harm that?
As I noted in the earlier comments, it seems more likely putting pressure on NK about these reporters could easily work to enhance international public pressure on Pyongyang concerning these other, more important issues: nuke testing and ICBM development and nuclear programs.
If I could see where there is a good chance taking up the issue of the two reporters would greatly retard progress on other issues, I’d agree it isn’t worth it.
But I don’t think that is the case.
Of course, if the US government doesn’t really care – if it doesn’t even want to waste the energy on an effort — none of this makes a difference anyway…
State Dept confirms that they cross the border.
http://liberatelaura.wordpress.com/2009/06/23/betrayed-at-the-border/
interesting that this info is released on a congress woman’s website…i’m sure it was intended to go out this way rather than through the state department daily briefings.
in any case, how irresponsible and reckless of ling and lee.
that said, the north korean judicial system is still a joke and there is no legitimate reason for holding the two.
The US cannot be tough on NK with the two journalists used as bargaining chips.